by virtualworks | May 31, 2026 | Transcript
Thriving Through Challenges: A Non-Profit’s Guide to Embracing ROWE – Podcast Transcript
I’m Barbara Best and this is Humans Working Remotely.
Across every sector, the workplace is evolving. Remote teams, automation, and the gig economy are changing how organizations operate and how people expect to work.
In this episode, we’ll explore how organizations can respond to the changing work landscape and why a Results-Only Work Environment, or ROWE, may be one of the keys to building a more flexible and resilient workplace.
Let’s dive in.
Non-profits face unique challenges, but ROWE can provide solutions that help them not only survive but thrive. Let’s explore strategies to embrace ROWE for long-term success.
To bring these strategies to life, let’s examine a real-life example: The American Red Cross.
First, the organization embraced flexibility, allowing employees to work from anywhere, anytime. For instance, Sarah, a disaster relief specialist, can now respond to emergencies remotely while coordinating with her team effectively.
Second, the American Red Cross invested in digital tools to improve collaboration and communication. John, a volunteer coordinator, uses video conferencing software to connect with volunteers across the country.
Finally, they focused on trust and accountability, fostering a results-driven culture. As a result, Susan, a marketing manager, enjoys more autonomy in her role while achieving her targets.
The American Red Cross demonstrates how embracing ROWE can help non-profits overcome challenges, resulting in increased flexibility, collaboration, and accountability.
That’s all for today’s episode of Humans Working Remotely. I hope the American Red Cross’s example inspires you to embrace ROWE in your non-profit organization. For more information, visit our website at virtualworks.ca and find us exclusively on LinkedIn, https://www.linkedin.com/in/virtualworks/. Join us next time for more valuable insights.
©Copyright 2026 Virtual Works Inc.
All rights reserved
DISCLAIMER
This material is provided for educational and informational purposes only.
No responsibility can be taken for any results or outcomes resulting from the use of this material.
The author does not assume any responsibility for the accuracy or use/misuse of this information.
by virtualworks | May 4, 2026 | Transcript
Empowering Non-Profits with ROWE – Podcast Transcript
I’m Barbara Best and this is Humans Working Remotely.
Across every sector, the workplace is evolving. Remote teams, automation, and the gig economy are changing how organizations operate and how people expect to work.
In this episode, we’ll explore how organizations can respond to the changing work landscape and why a Results-Only Work Environment, or ROWE, may be one of the keys to building a more flexible and resilient workplace.
Let’s dive in.
ROWE offers numerous benefits for non-profits, from increased productivity to improved work-life balance. Let’s explore how ROWE empowers organizations like yours.
To illustrate these advantages, let’s examine a real-life example: The Minnesota Council of Nonprofits (MCN).
First, MCN experienced a boost in productivity after implementing ROWE. Sarah, a program coordinator, reported increased efficiency by working during her peak focus hours.
Second, ROWE improved work-life balance for MCN employees. John, a communications specialist, now manages his personal commitments while meeting project deadlines.
Finally, ROWE fostered trust and collaboration at MCN, resulting in better teamwork and decision-making. During a major fundraising event, the team worked together seamlessly despite different schedules and locations.
As demonstrated by MCN, ROWE can be a game-changer for non-profits, improving productivity, work-life balance, and teamwork. Embrace ROWE to empower your organization for success.
That’s all for today’s episode of Humans Working Remotely. I hope you found MCN’s example inspiring for your own ROWE journey. For more information, visit our website at https://virtualworks.ca and find us exclusively on LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/. Join us next time for another thought-provoking conversation.
©Copyright 2026 Virtual Works Inc.
All rights reserved
DISCLAIMER
This material is provided for educational and informational purposes only.
No responsibility can be taken for any results or outcomes resulting from the use of this material.
The author does not assume any responsibility for the accuracy or use/misuse of this information.
by virtualworks | Apr 4, 2026 | Transcript
What if the way we work isn’t working for us anymore? – Podcast Transcript
I’m Barbara Best and this is Humans Working Remotely, ROWE edition.
What if the way we’ve always worked… isn’t working for us anymore.
Across every sector, the workplace is evolving. Remote teams, automation, and the gig economy are changing how organizations operate and how people expect to work. For non-profits and associations, these shifts can create both opportunities and challenges. So how do mission-driven organizations stay adaptable while continuing to serve their communities effectively?
In this episode, we’ll explore how organizations can respond to the changing work landscape and why a Results-Only Work Environment, or ROWE, may be one of the keys to building a more flexible and resilient workplace.
Let’s dive in.
The work landscape has undergone significant transformations in recent years, with trends like remote work, automation, and the gig economy reshaping how organizations operate. As non-profits and associations navigate these changes, it’s essential to stay ahead of the curve by understanding the challenges and adopting effective strategies. In this episode, we’ll explore some ways your organization can adapt to the evolving work environment and discuss how implementing a Results-Only Work Environment (ROWE) can facilitate workplace flexibility and resilience.
Several key trends have emerged in the modern workplace, presenting both opportunities and challenges for non-profits:
- Remote Work: With the rise of digital technologies, employees can now work from anywhere, which can save costs and expand the talent pool. However, this may also lead to communication barriers and feelings of isolation.
- Automation and Artificial Intelligence: Advanced technologies are automating tasks, changing job roles, and increasing efficiency. However, this also raises concerns around job security and the need for new skill sets.
- Gig Economy: More people are opting for freelance or contract work, offering organizations a flexible workforce. However, managing, and engaging gig workers requires a different approach to traditional employees.
To adapt to the evolving work landscape, non-profits can implement the following strategies:
- Invest in Digital Tools: Equip your team with collaboration and productivity tools like project management platforms or communication apps to support remote work and automate tasks.
- Focus on Employee Well-being: Offer mental health resources, promote work-life balance, and provide flexible schedules to support employees in adapting to changes and maintaining a healthy work environment.
- Upskill and Reskill: Provide training opportunities to help your team develop new skills and navigate emerging technologies.
- Strengthen Communication: Establish clear communication channels, set expectations, and provide opportunities for social interactions to keep your team connected and engaged.
ROWE, a management strategy focusing on performance rather than working hours, plays a critical role in helping organizations adapt to the changing work landscape. Here’s how:
- Embracing Remote Work and Gig Economy: ROWE’s flexibility allows employees to work from anywhere and accommodates gig workers, ensuring seamless collaboration across distributed teams and enabling organizations to tap into a broader talent pool.
- Supporting Employee Well-being: With ROWE, employees have greater control over their schedules, promoting work-life balance, reducing stress, and boosting morale.
- Fostering Resilience: By empowering employees to manage their time and responsibilities, ROWE enhances adaptability to changes and resilience in the face of challenges.
To successfully implement ROWE in your non-profit, follow these steps:
- Assess Readiness: Evaluate your organization’s culture, policies, and infrastructure to determine if they align with ROWE principles.
- Communicate the Change: Clearly explain the benefits and expectations of ROWE to employees and stakeholders.
- Provide Training and Support: Offer resources and training to help managers and employees adapt to the new work environment.
- Monitor and Adjust: Continuously evaluate the impact of ROWE on your organization and adjust as needed.
Adapting to change is essential in today’s fast-paced work environment and embracing strategies like ROWE can help your non-profit not only keep up but thrive and stay ahead of the game. By understanding the trends, addressing challenges, and leveraging the benefits of ROWE, your organization can build a more productive, engaged, and resilient workforce, ultimately furthering your mission and making a more significant impact.
Tune in next time for more engaging conversation. Until then, visit us online at virtualworks.ca and find us exclusively on LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/.
©Copyright 2026 Virtual Works Inc.
All rights reserved
DISCLAIMER
This material is provided for educational and informational purposes only.
No responsibility can be taken for any results or outcomes resulting from the use of this material.
The author does not assume any responsibility for the accuracy or use/misuse of this information.
by virtualworks | Oct 23, 2022 | Transcript
Productivity Hacks! – Podcast Transcript
Barbara: Hi, I’m Barbara Best and this is Humans Working Remotely, a podcast where I’ll show you how to meet the expanding needs of your organization by utilizing alternative solutions for operational staffing. Through expert insight and meaningful conversations with business professionals, we’ll talk about common challenges and proven strategies that will provide you with more time to focus on your organization’s mission, relationship building and other high value growth activities.
Did you know being highly productive is not an innate talent. It’s simply a matter of organizing your life so that you can efficiently get things done at the right time based on how you process information. Everyone’s different. So Kerri, remember those SMART goals that we learned before the turn of the century?
Kerri: Oh, goodness, yes. Doesn’t everybody?
Barbara: They’ve been around a long time, and they have ad nauseum.
Kerri: Oh, my god because they’re so old, they get used and kind of ignored, I think. So, it’s great that you’ve mentioned them with the smart, measurable, attainable, relevant time bound. However, there is way more that we can apply to make us more productive, right?
Barbara: Yeah, absolutely. And first and foremost in my mind, is breaking down those goals, those huge goals, into smaller pieces.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Right? Otherwise, you’re going to lose your mind because you’ll be so overwhelmed. There’s this great big goal in front of you, and it could comprise of a lot of different components and pieces. And it’s so overwhelming sometimes, that you won’t do it, you just won’t.
Kerri: No, exactly.
Barbara: Yeah. So, the best thing is to break those down into little pieces that have significance for you.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: Not me, not anybody else. For you.
Kerri: Exactly.
Barbara: Yep. And further to that, breaking those down into little pieces to sort of, I don’t know, coincide with your schedule, you can break it down into, say, half hour time slots on your schedule. Different pieces to do at different times in a logical sequence. And then by the end of the week, you got her done?
Kerri: Well, yes. And I think that one of the key pieces, like you mentioned, is making tiny baby steps. Because if you look at stuff, a lot of times, too, that’s one of the strategies that I’ve done. If I set a big goal, and I don’t achieve it, I have to look at it and go, “okay, why didn’t I?” A lot of times, it’s because I put the goal down as a big thing to do, and I didn’t allow the proper amount of time. But if I’m able to take the overarching, this is what I need to get accomplished, and then I can break it down into manageable pieces, then I can say, “Okay, I’m going to get this and this and this done this morning,” and then I can move. Even if I did that five days in a row, and I’ve got that five chunks, I’ve got a huge amount done by the end of the week. But if I set up to get that huge amount done without looking at it at five chunks, it’s like, well, how am I going to do that in a day, and get anything else done?
Barbara: That’s right.
Kerri: Right? So, having that to make it so that you can never make it to be digestible. Plus, if it’s littler, you’re not going to get as “Oh my God, I don’t want to do this”. Which everybody does, right? Everybody gets to that point? It’s like,” Oh, I just don’t want to do this”.
Barbara: Yes.
Kerri: That’s right. And creating systems for those little pieces, for each little piece that you’ve come up with that comprises that goal, for each little piece, create a little system, yes, to help you work through that task. And it helps for me anyway, it helps to work backwards. So, say you’ve got a task in front of you, and then you think, “Okay, I’m going to allow half an hour for that task”. And then I think, “just stop and think for a second, what do I need to get that task done?” Do I have the resources I need? Do I have the software? Do I have the capability, the interest? And that way, you’re prepared ahead of time. And you’re pre-rewarding yourself, or you’re setting yourself up for success ahead of time. Even if it’s only a half hour little task, thinking it through ahead of time, will set you up for success and actually get it done.
Kerri: Oh, that Yeah, that makes total sense. Actually, I’ve never tried that. But I would imagine doing it that way, because of the way you just described it. You’re automatically seeing the end result completed.
Barbara: Yep. Yeah. Oh, Stephen Covey, who has that famous phrase “begin with the end in mind”.
Kerri: Okay, yes. That was way back in the 90s probably. But it’s good advice. If you can see your end goal, work backwards. Yes, you can with the end in mind. It’s really helped me out a lot. And the other thing that helps me because I’m a linear thinker, who’s very logical, I have to have my space organized as well.
Kerri: Okay.
Barbara: For me here in the home office, I have everything. All my files, folders, collateral material, it’s all behind me. The only thing that’s in front of me is my monitor. Not everyone works that way. Some people thrive with having papers everywhere. And they know where everything is and all that. I’m not like that, I put everything behind where I’m sitting. And then I focus on one thing at a time, whatever’s in front of me on my monitor, and on my blotter if I happen to be working in paper, that’s the only thing I work on.
Kerri: And then you just put stuff in front of you that you’re working on. Then you put it back where it was.
Barbara: Yes, everything like that. To me, it’s just noise. I can’t cope with paper all over my desk. I can’t handle it. So you know, like, everybody’s different, though.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And you have to find what your comfort environment is. what helps you be productive?
Kerri: Sure. True enough.
Barbara: Yes, everybody’s different.
Kerri: Yes. Well, and when you mentioned the systems, which includes your organized space, I’m guessing for people who haven’t tried those methods, once you start doing it a little bit, every once in a while, it will become a habit that will make it easier.
Barbara: Yes, it will in the long term. So like, I thought that of course, you have to adjust, you know, some days, maybe you’re having a bad day, or you’re not in the right frame of mind to do something every day. Just adjust and don’t beat yourself up about it. If it’s not working for you, just do the best you can and then start again tomorrow.
Kerri: Yes, good idea. Good idea.
Barbara: Yes. The other thing I do too is, I schedule my workday way ahead. In fact, I can make a more global statement. I preview my week, my work week ahead of the week, I do that on Sunday afternoons, always have. So, I have my work diary for operations. And I have my Outlook calendar for client facing work. And Sunday afternoon, I take a couple of hours and I just review everything. I think through my week. Think through my deadlines. Think through my people in my team. And it may sound like a lot, but actually it’s not. Because once you are in your groove, you’ve got your systems in place and it really becomes automatic. And you’re just thinking it through and you’re making notes, and I print off my hardcopy calendar, stick it on the fridge, so when I’m not in the office, and I go down for a cup of tea. My calendar is there. I can see “Oh yeah, I’ve got a call with Kerry at 3:30 today”. You know, that kind of thing?
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: So yes, I know it’s a piece of paper, but I always print on both sides of a piece of paper anyway. And I recycle it or shred it. All right. So it’s okay.
Kerri: Yes, and that makes a lot of sense.
Barbara: So, Kerri, so what do you do for that? Do you review your calendar ahead of time? Or how does that work for you?
Kerri: I do, I well, and I set reminders. So, most of the time, if I’m not at my computer, I’m out with clients, or working on clients specific stuff, which means everything shuts down. So, I have reminders that will come up on my phone, and on my calendar on my computer, and it will remind me of stuff that’s coming in. I’ll do like a few days in advance. But I do like to look at my whole week.
Barbara: Yes.
Kerri: The challenge that I have found, and this goes to organizing the goals as well, if I have a day where things get away from me like we were talking earlier about how it happens.
Barbara: Yes.
Kerri: Yes. And I have a tendency, I had a tendency, because I don’t now, I had a tendency to get mad at myself. It’s like, “Oh, I didn’t get it done”. And I remember somebody saying to me about looking forward. And sometimes the horizon that you’re aiming for is so far away, that it’s like you haven’t gone anywhere. And the trick to make sure that that doesn’t confuse you and push you down, is to turn around and look at where you’ve been. So, one of the things that I do on days that get away from me, and I might have that feeling of like, “Oh, I didn’t get things done”. It’s like “Oh, no, wait a minute. Okay. What did I do?”. So, then I end up with a I did list as opposed to a to-do list.
Barbara: Yes. So that’s a great idea.
Kerri: Well, it’s just a matter of going back, like even if it’s a matter of looking at your browser history, to remind you of all the things that you’ve done, right? I researched this. I did this, I did that. But a lot of times when days like that come, you’re just so overwhelmed by the end of the day, and you’re feeling like the things that were on your list didn’t get done. Right, when they’re not coming. If you’ve got client facing stuff, yes, they get taken care of. But then there’s the productivity and the operations and the new stuff. You know, the administrivia takes sometimes, way too much time. Yeah, if I can go back and look at what I did do and make a list of what I have got accomplished. Then I don’t get caught up in that “Oh, I didn’t get my to do list done right”. Because otherwise it’s just standing there. It’s just sitting there waiting and taunting me “Oh, you didn’t do this. We didn’t do this”. No, I didn’t but I did this and this and this and this. Right. So I find that for me, I find that really, really helpful because otherwise you just get caught up in that you know.
Barbara: Oh yes.
Kerri: Absolutely.
Barbara: And it happens quite often when your day slides out from under you. That’s a great idea to focus on what you did get done.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And, you know, you can adjust. One of my last dogs, Archie, he was a wonderful guy. I swear to god he wore a watch. Because he would come and get me at my desk, 7:30, 11:30, 4:30 every day. He would be sitting at my desk staring at me with that look like, “Okay, it’s time. Come on. Let’s go.” And I remember one particular day I was on a deadline, I was rushing to get something done, and he’s sitting beside me, you know, just to the bottom right of my keyboard. And he’s looking at me with those eyes.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And I had to get this deadline done. And I’m looking at him and I typing. And I’m looking at him and I’m typing. And I thought, “oh, that’s what you’re teaching me. Nothing’s that urgent that we can’t go outside for a walk for half an hour”.
Kerri: Oh, wow.
Barbara: And that’s exactly what we did. So, from that day forward, yes we have deadlines. You know, we try and plan as much as we can, but sometimes our days fly right out from under us.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Even still, you know, go outside for half an hour. It’s not that urgent. It’s going to be there when you get back.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: You’ll probably hit your deadline anyway. You know, like, give yourself a break. He was a wonderful dog. He taught me a lot. I’m sorry, you were going to say?
Kerri: No, no, I was just going to say that when there’s a deadline, I’m so bad at this. I get that in my head, “I have to get this done”, and I won’t get up. But I know having the dog there, somebody saying “Come on, move”. Yes. It’s not too stressed to get it. You know, you’re never too busy to just take time to go for a walk. But the other thing is, after that break to go out, I remember my mentor took me out one day, we went for lunch. And we just relaxed. I mean, it was like we were drinking, and socializing, and we weren’t, I was drinking water and talking. And it was like three hours, we just sat. And because he knew that I would come in, and other than getting up to go make coffee or to make my lunch, I would eat my lunch in front of my computer. And just because I was just so excited about everything I was doing. And his whole thing was to try and convey to me and he showed me that day that we had that lunch, how your perspective changes, just from getting up, just going away. Right? So, when you say about Archie wanting to go for a walk and taking that time to take him for a walk, immediately your perspective changes.
Barbara: Which means coming back with a brand new, refreshed “Ah, now I can go into this”. And then you say, you’re still going to meet your deadline. But you’re not going to have that “I’ve got to get this done.”
Kerri: Yes, that’s right.
Barbara: Right? So that’s right. Absolutely. Yes, well, Arch, he passed away five years ago in June now, right. And I remember those fourteen months between dogs. All I did was work. Like what you just said, all I did was work.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: I didn’t go out for a walk three times a day. And the only breaks I had was I’d get some lunch, or go down for a cup of tea, and then I’d go back to work.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: It was terrible. But now our new dog Wolfie, he doesn’t wear a watch, but he does get me out for walks three times a day. And it really does make a difference in your mindset.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And your productivity.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Even if it’s half an hour or fifteen minutes even? Go out and get some fresh air, do something, go somewhere, go to a park. And it’s amazing what it does for your productivity.
Kerri: Yes, I agree.
Barbara: Fabulous.
Kerri: Very much so. So, what other ideas do you have? So, let’s say we’ve got all these plans, and we follow all these ideas that we’ve just talked about? What else can we do to stay there, to maintain for ourselves and moving forward into “Okay, I’ve got this laid out”, like looking at your week and having all these plans. What else can we do?
Barbara: Well, one thing I do, I have a morning ritual.
Kerri: Okay.
Barbara: And I’ve developed this over many, many years, and I have figured out what works for me.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: And that morning ritual, for the most part, takes from about 6:00 a.m. to about 8:30 or so.
Kerri: Okay.
Barbara: Every day.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: And that involves in that timeframe, of course I take my dog for a walk, that’s a given, a pot of green tea, but I also do three other things. I do some learning of some sort. Whether that’s reading, or doing brain games, or crossword puzzles, Sudoku, whatever it is.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: I spend a significant time on physical fitness. So, I’ll go cycling, I’ll do elliptical, I’ll lift weights. Whatever it happens to be.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: And the third thing is mental work, or mindfulness work, where I journal, or I write something that’s meaningful for me. Even if I make a list of five things I’m grateful for this morning. It really makes a difference. And so, all of those things accumulate to set me up for the day. So that gets me off on the right foot. And then I, you know, personal care or whatever. I’m usually at my desk at nine o’clock or more or less, with a pot of green tea in front of me, and I’m ready to go.
Kerri: I love that idea.
Barbara: But there again Kerri, everybody’s different. You may despise exercise, you may not like Sudoko. You know, you have to find what works for you. Some people aren’t morning people.
Kerri: No, that’s true.
Barbara: It’s that everybody’s different. But I think maybe if you’re mindful about maybe discovering something new to do that might change your mental state before you go to work. It could be as simple as, in these days of remote working everywhere, maybe it’s a matter of getting into your head, that you’re going to get dressed, show up and get ready. What’s that phrase? Get up, dress up, show up for work.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: So, if you’re in a corporate job, maybe it’s a matter of changing your mindset that yes, even though I’m working from home, I’m going to do my personal care, I’m going to put on a suit and a tie, or my usual office clothes, a dress and a blazer, whatever it is.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: My face is on. I’ve got it all going on. And I’m going to sit there in my home office or workspace, and just go through a regular work day.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Because for me, if you get up, dress up and show up, that again changes your mindset. So, it is a productivity mindset as well.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Because that’s what you’re used to doing to go to the office, you’re dressing for office attire, do the same thing at home?
Kerri: Well, and that makes that makes a lot of sense. It’s maintaining for people who have worked in an office as opposed to the people who have always, or for many years like you, have worked remotely. Just having a consistent, like you say just a consistent ritual, whatever it is, if it is going to an office, have the same ritual at home. Even if it’s not the same as what yours is, of course, and it doesn’t have to be because it’s not anybody’s but yours. But just having that pattern, having that rhythm that you’re already creating, that’s setting the groove up so that you can just keep going and going and going. And again, it’s going to be like the things that we talked about, where you set a system in place, and then you do it often enough, and it becomes a habit. That will be the same thing with this. Right? And that, I think, are such good ideas to have them regimented. It sounds regimented, initially to me, it sounds regimented like “Oh, my goodness, that’s just so much, just to try and organize that”. And yet, it also sounds very logical, because it’s setting up your day to be productive from the start. Because you’re getting yourself right in that same headspace.
Barbara: The other thing I do Kerri, is I set boundaries for meetings.
Kerri: Oh.
Barbara: It may sound harsh, but I’m not available for meetings from Monday to Friday 9:30 to 4:00. I’m just not. I have blocks Tuesday and Thursday afternoons.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: That’s when you can have a meeting with me. You have to, you’ll end up getting pulled in so many directions, by so many people, who take up your time, probably more time than they actually think they need to spend with you.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: So I use Calendly. And I send a link with a predetermined time slot, like an hour or thirty minutes, or it’s by phone, or it’s by zoom. And I send that link in an email. I say “Here, you click on that. It’ll give you my availability for the type of meeting that we’re going to have. My availability Tuesdays and Thursday afternoons”. Just, you know, pick one. And it sends a message of “Yes, I have boundaries. You are important, but we have to meet only during these times”.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And it stops me from being pulled in 100 different directions.
Kerri: And having to say no.
Barbara: Yes, exactly. And the other thing, too is that it gives people a chance to prepare ahead of time.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: That if they pick next Thursday at five, that means they’ll have a week to prepare what they want to meet me about.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: So, it probably will reduce my meeting time anyway. And it’s just, a great productivity hack. I think it is anyway. There’s loads of online calendar systems out there that are all pretty much the same. I really like Calendly, though, and it just saves so much time, even emailing back and forth
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: You know, when you’ve got “Oh, I’ve made available these dates. And these times, what works for you” comes back, I have this date, but not this day, and on and on. So, it’s easier just to set it up in Calendly ahead of time. And in that program, you can set your parameters, and design how many event types and put in links, you can do all kinds of stuff, and then just send that link by email once. And it also sends reminders to the people ahead of time. It’s fabulous. So that saves me a lot of time and energy as well.
Kerri: That sounds really, really effective.
Barbara: Yes, it is.
Kerri: Well, and I think the fact that you have already developed this, I don’t know for me, I don’t know about other people, but I never thought about having it especially just for meetings, if somebody says are you available? And I will try and accommodate them, and put my other stuff, other than Mondays, normally I do not have any calls or anything on Mondays, because that’s my prep for the week. And I take that day and get everything ready. And just especially Monday mornings. I can sometimes manage Monday afternoons, but I don’t like to. But I never thought of just saying no. I really never did. I never thought it would have been that simple. And I love how you just framed it in that. Yeah, that’s marvelous. I love that idea.
Barbara: It’s that’s simple.
Kerri: It is, as you say, it saves all kinds of time. And it saves you having to, you know, defend your time and your boundaries, just suck them up. There they are. I think though, it would likely be a challenge for people who have never really thought about when their most productive times are. Right? Especially people who are new to remote work or have had in an an office setting, had somebody else dictate when their meetings were.
Barbara: Yes, that’s true.
Kerri: And they don’t necessarily know what is their best time. So, like you say, some people don’t like mornings, some people love to do first things first thing in the morning. So again, it’s going to depend on what they are. But people have to really pay attention to where their own strengths are and their own mental rhythms.
Barbara: Right.
Kerri: Because that’s going to depend on what’s going to work. But that’s a great idea. I love that.
Barbara: I would say generally people are at their best and do perhaps detail work better in the morning, when they’re fresh, and they haven’t processed that much information.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And then as the day wears on, they’ve processed a lot of information. So, for me anyway, I do tend to do the higher level work, like the long term planning or thirty-thousand foot sort of scheduling tasks kind of thing, that don’t take a lot of brainpower. I tend to do those in the afternoon.
Kerri: Okay.
Barbara: Because I feel myself getting mentally tired towards the end of the day. But there again, like you say, everybody’s different. We might be talking about night owls who’s most productive time is at ten o’clock at night.
Kerri: Like people with international clients, right?
Barbara: Yes, exactly.
Kerry: Yes, exactly. Yes.
Barbara: The other thing that I do too, and we talked about this last week when we were doing our email segment, is to set up the rules in outlook, so that all my emails shunt to different folders.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Instead of having all emails come into one inbox, which I said last week would drive me nuts, I have set up rules. So, they go into different places. And I review those emails on my schedule, and not on anyone else’s schedule.
Kerri: Yes. Which overall, it does keep the productivity going. Because it’s what works best for us, not other people.
Barbara: Yes, you have to take control. Yeah, absolutely.
Kerri: No question.
Barbara: Yes. What do you do? Do you have any hacks like that, like, what do you do to keep your sanity? I’m day to day.
Kerri: I’m very specific when I’m talking to people. I found that most people are really, really good with breadth. Paying attention to time limits.
Barbara: Right.
Kerri: I know that this is something else that you and I have talked about as well. Just being aware of “I have this schedule. You can have this much time. I have to go.” And some people, I have found, continue to talk, which really bothers me. Because I find it very disrespectful. But I also have got to the point where I will tell them, and if I have to tell them three times, I will say, “Okay, well, I’m gonna have to go now. I’ll talk to you soon. Bye bye”. And I hang up. Right? And I’m not hanging up on them, because I’m telling them I’m hanging up. But my time is precious, and I am not prepared to waste it on people who are not prepared to respect my time.
Barbara: Yes, I agree completely.
Kerri: Yes, and even with you, when you said about setting up your calendar to send to people and say “here’s my windows”, that’s the same type of thing, right? Because you’re saying, “these are my windows”, right? But sometimes you still have to come in and remind them.
Barbara: Yes.
Kerri: Like little kids, right? “Okay, five more minutes, we’re gonna put away our blocks. Okay, two more minutes”. I have to tell you, if I don’t tell them, they get into this, you know, they get running and get themselves ramped up, and they’re in the middle of talking or something, and it’s like, “Listen, I gotta go, man, I have other things that I have to do”. I’ve just got to go. And I hate shutting people down. So, especially when they’re in the middle of something that they’re really passionate about, and they’re sharing, and they want to share it. And I’m happy that they want to share it with me. But I don’t want them to get shut down in the middle of it. Because really that’s such a disheartening feeling, I know even for me, right? So, if I know I’m dealing with somebody like that, I always like to make sure that I give them the warnings like the little people. You know, “We’re gonna get off the phone in 10 minutes, just so you know”. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay.
Barbara: Yeah, that’s fine.
Kerri: Like, okay, well, “I’m gonna have to go” and then keep talking.
Barbara: Oh, yes.
Kerri: But it’s important to, for me at least, to be able to say, here’s my time limit and I’m very strict with it. And I let people know, I’m strict with it. I think that’s really a powerful message to let people know.
Barbara. Yes, I agree. Yes.`The other thing I do, and this may sound counter-intuitive, because I work from home, is I outsource personal chores. Always have.
Kerri: Oh!
Barbara: Yes. I mean, I remember this. When I started in 2004. When I decided I was going to start a virtual assistant practice, one of the people I met networking, she was a business coach. I said to her, oh, I work from home now. I don’t have to have my housekeeper come in anymore. And she said, “Uh, you don’t want to do that”
Kerri: No, because that’s taken away from your day
Barbara: Why wouldn’t I? And she said, “Well, you’re going to be busy running a company, you won’t have time to do your housework”. And you know, she’s right.
Kerri: Yeah, because if you were out of the office, you wouldn’t be doing it.
Barbara: Exactly. Exactly. And my housekeeper is with me to this day. That was seventeen years ago. And it’s so true. I have other things to do. Doing housework is not on my priority list. Not to mention, I hate doing housework anyway. But it’s not on my priority list anyway. I outsource my dry cleaning, I have people coming to do my yard work, you know, all these different things. And for me, it comes down to a return on investment. What is worth my time to do? Is it worth my time to take three hours out every day to do my housework, not everyday, you know, weekly, to do my housework. Is it worth my time to do the yard work daily, twice a week, whatever it is.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: Or is it worth it for me to do online networking, or make some sales calls or do my marketing material.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: For me, because I run a company, and it just happens to be in my house, I’m like everyone else who has a full time job. It’s just in a different place. So, for me, working on the marketing materials, doing the online networking, social media stuff, it’s more worth my time to do it.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: So, that’s why I outsource the other stuff.
Kerri: That’s a really good idea. I never thought about that.
Barbara: Yes.
Kerri: And it does make sense. But again, like you said, when you’re at home, people, as well as ourselves don’t always think of that when you’re working. Well, you’re home, you can do it. No, no, no, no, exactly. Okay, so that’s a really good thing to remember. Because it’s so easy to get caught up in the things that need to get done around the house. Especially when you’re here all the time working and seeing it.
Barbara: Yes, and and sometimes you do get lured in, like you think, oh, I’ve just done a load of laundry, and I don’t think I’ve ever done that. I don’t think I’ve ever done laundry during the week.
Kerri: Wow.
Barbara: Well, I do it on the weekend like everybody else to save money because Hydro is cheaper on the weekend.
Kerri: Yes, exactly.
Barbara: So yes. I’ve put my mind in that frame where, when I’m in my office, I’m working.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: I’m not at home. And it took me, anyway, about six months to make that transition in my brain. That it’s two different things. It’s two different mindsets.
Kerri: Right, though.
Barbara: Yes. Anyway, it helps me anyway. It keeps me sane for one thing. And, you know, I’m focused on work when I’m in my office, and when I close the door at the end of the day, walk downstairs and start dinner, that’s when I’m in my personal space.
Kerri: Yes. Now, do you have, for you personally, do you use a to-do list? Or do you simply create space on your calendar to work on, you know, admin or marketing? Or like, how do you do it when it comes to a to-do list, or I did list. Like, do you break it down into little pieces or do you put it in chunks and just give yourself like a certain amount of time?
Barbara: It’s a combination of both. I block off time.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: In the summertime, mostly, I usually have Wednesdays as my admin day, because Wednesday mornings I play golf in the summer, every Wednesday, except for this year because the program was postponed. But anyway, most of the time I play golf Wednesday morning, and then Wednesday afternoon, I do all my admin stuff.
Kerri: Okay.
Barbara: I block off that time. It’s only really a couple of hours. And then for the rest of the time, I have a combination of to-do lists. I make a blotter every week, I call it a blotter.
Kerri: Okay.
Barbara: And one of the things I do on a Sunday afternoon, is I go through my schedule, and I review upcoming tasks and deadlines. I write my blotter every Sunday. So, it just gives me a handle on what’s coming up.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: And it helps me sort of pace out my week, and what can I expect, and you know, that kind of thing. So, again, everybody’s different. You just really have to find what works for you.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And some people, I think, would get overwhelmed with all these lists everywhere. I personally am a list person. I’m happy with lists and calendars. I’m good there. And that’s just what works for me. How about you? What do you do?
Kerri: Well, a lot of those times, what I’ll do is, I have a list, but if I’m using my calendar, I’ll block off hours that will say, Okay, this is my admin. And at a glance, I can see my admin is a certain color, right? It’s like when I’m working on clients. My client times are always green, because that’s money, I’m making money.
Barbara: Oh, good one, right.
Kerri: And then I have time that’s business development. So that’s usually blue. And then I have administration and operation. So, go between orange and red, depending. But what I do is, I’ll put my list on the inside. I’ll create an event type thing with a block of time and a color. And then on the notes part of the event, is where I’ll put my list of bullets. Because otherwise, like you said, otherwise, I’m seeing way too many things all at once that can look really overwhelming. And I have a tendency to get myself caught up before I get going. So, I wait until I get into it. When I open the event, it’s like, okay, there’s all the stuff I need to get done. I can move it. If it doesn’t get done that day, I can move it to the next day that I have that I’m working on that. But having the color coding also helps me look at it that if I don’t have enough green, that I don’t have enough sales, enough working appointments or generating money.
Barbara: Right?
Kerri: If I don’t have enough blue, then I’m not doing enough business development. I can tell at a glance just by looking even at a month. And it’s like, Oh, I have got to plan some more stuff for this week here. Because I don’t have just the colors.? So, I find between the colors and the blocking off, for me, I just use all three.
Barbara: That’s a really good idea.
Kerri: Yes, I just find that it’s really effective. And even when I’m doing my coaching calls, I’ll make a list of things that I’m talking with my clients about. And if there’s stuff that we talked about, but it hasn’t gotten done, then I just move it to the next week.
Barbara: Yes.
Kerri: And it’s like, Okay, what about this, but then as we go, I just keep adding to it, but I don’t like to see giant lists, because they just overwhelm me.
Barbara: Yes, they can be overwhelming.
Kerri: Yes, so I just do whatever. I just I really like the colors. I find that that makes it easy at a glance.
Barbara: Well, it’s an easy visual.
Kerri: Yes, exactly.
Barbara: And you can see at a glance how much you need of what thing? And I think that’s a great idea. I really do.
Kerri: I keeps you from having to remember it, because if I have to depend on my memory…
Barbara: Yes, I know. I know.
Kerri: Yes, yes.
Barbara: You’re probably are like me, where one day in the future you’re thinking, Oh, I got a day off this, you know, I want one or two things to do. And then your day goes on and your day goes on. And then before you know it, the day’s almost over and you haven’t done them yet. And then to do that in the last half hour, I’ve done that so many times, it’s embarrassing. I’m embarrassed to even say it, but me with, you know, so high in productivity, and lists and calendars and so on, it does actually happen. It has happened where I’ve had all day to do something, and I do those two tasks in the last half hour.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: So, I found, and through hard lessons, I found the best way to get around that, or to manage that even, is to shorten the container. And by that, I mean, shorten the window in which you give yourself to do the task, meaning one hour as opposed to eight hours. And then, when you get those tasks done in the appropriate hour, you’re going to give yourself that pre-promised reward. The reward that you said, Oh, if I get those two things done in the next hour, I’m going to go treat myself to a massage.
Kerri: Oh, I like that idea.
Barbara: Yes. So, then you keep that reward in the back of your mind. And that, to me anyway, it enhances my productivity, that I want to get that done. I promise the reward to myself. So, if I get it done now, between nine and ten, get those two things done, I’ll go have a massage, and then I can have the rest of the day off.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Right? Yes, it’s way better than having those tasks hanging over you for eight hours. And you’re saying, oh, I’ll do it, I’ll do it, I’ll do it. Before you know it, the days over and you haven’t done it.
Kerri: I Know. Exactly. And it’s so easy to say I’m gonna do it first thing. And then you put it off, or especially if it’s something that you need to do and you know that it has to be done on a day off, but you really don’t want to do it. No, I don’t want to do that later. And then, like you say, it just doesn’t get done until the last minute, and by the time you get around to that last minute, it’s been nagging at you in the back of your head.
Barbara: All day.
Kerri: Don’t forget you got to do that.
Barbara: Yes, we’re so human aren’t we, we are so human.
Kerri: True enough. Yes.
Barbara: Well, it’s been great Kerri, talking about all these productivity ideas. Thanks for joining me today’s.
Kerri: Thank you for having me. I’ve learned a lot. I’ve got a lot of information from you, and I’m really excited to start putting some of them in place.
Barbara: Great, wonderful.
Kerri: Yes. Thanks. Okay. Take care. Yes. Bye bye.
Barbara: In closing, I’d like to thank you so much for listening today. I hope this information is helpful and I look forward to providing you more. I’m Barbara Best, CEO of Virtual Works Inc.
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by virtualworks | Sep 12, 2022 | Transcript
Boundaries Really Are Important – Podcast Transcript
Barbara: Hi, I’m Barbara Best and this is Humans Working Remotely. A podcast where I’ll show you how to meet the expanding needs of your organization by utilizing alternative solutions for operational staffing. Through expert insight and meaningful conversations with business professionals, we’ll talk about common challenges and proven strategies that will provide you with more time to focus on your organization’s mission, relationship building and other high value growth activities.
Barbara: We can all admit that working on nights or weekends has happened on occasion. But remember that all work and no play will make you cranky from day to day. If you’re feeling you’re like your work is creeping into your personal time, here’s a few steps to help establish reasonable healthy boundaries for you and those around you. Keep in mind that these tips work whether you’re working in person or remotely. Number one, avoid work devices after hours. I don’t want to get into the concept of addiction. But some of us really have an addiction to our phones. Kerri, you can probably relate to this I personally, I’m not addicted to my phone. I use it as a productivity tool, I use the timer, I use my calendar, but when it’s 4:30. and time to go, that sucker gets turned off.
Kerri: Yes. Yes, I’m the same. Although it’s it takes me it takes me time to transition to not having it. When I’m working I turn off unless I have like, I’d rather use timers instead of on my phone. I’d rather have them sitting on my computer so that my phone isn’t something I have to handle because I know I have the weakness. Oh, oh, well, I just checked these notifications, and I’ll check these and it’s like that get lost. So that’s Yeah, that’s one of the it’s a big challenge for me at times. But then the other times I just set it aside and I don’t even use it. So make a difference.
Barbara: Yeah, good for you. So these avoiding work devices after hours, that’s also setting a boundary around your work day as well.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: You need to define your office hours, like nine to five or whatever it happens to be Monday, Wednesday, Friday, whatever it is, and let your clients and colleagues know that you’re available during these times.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Really. I mean, you can cheat. And I know we’ve talked about this before. You can cheat and write emails after hours. You can also schedule them ahead of time to send, leave them in draft or Gmail I know and so out and so does Outlook. You can delay send. So you can write your emails at night, schedule them to send at nine o’clock the next day. And you look like you’re in your office right at nine o’clock. Yeah. makes you look really good.
Kerri: Yep. Well, on the other, the other option is even if you don’t want to try and find those things to do the schedule send, because it’s just one more thing that’s going to take up your time. Leave it like you said, leave it in the draft mode, and then whenever you because I mean, I know that successful people successfully time manage people have specific times of day that they’ll check their email. So if you if you do respond as I mean, because a lot of times I work late at night sometimes because I’m just getting the mood, right, but I don’t want my emails to go there. So I’ll just tuck it away. And then when I know, I’m going into the into my time to check my emails, it’s like, oh, yeah, I got these I have to send, and then I send them. Because otherwise we have if we don’t do that we’re teaching people, if they get an email from us at nine o’clock at night, then they’ll think that they can write back to us, and then respond. Well, you did it before.
Barbara: Yeah, you’re setting a precedent for sure.
Kerri: Yeah. And I remember one of my business coach used to say to me always start the way you want to finish. Right? And and you have to teach people from the beginning how to treat you. If you don’t respect your hours, and you don’t teach them to respect them, they won’t. The other example is when somebody says, Oh, well, you know, you’re just working at home. Can I come over after soccer practice tonight?
Barbara: Yeah.
Kerri: I work till five o’clock. Oh, you’re just I’ve had I’ve heard this on different different reasons. Yes. Oh, and it’s always a just. Just you’re just working from home. As if somehow that that negates the value of the work you’re doing because you’re not in an office environment you’re in a home. And again, though you have but if you don’t, if you don’t say, no, you can’t come by after soccer practice, or no, I’m not going to work this weekend or no, you can’t come by on Saturday afternoon after you go shopping at Costco. No. Sorry, but if you don’t tell them and they get away with it once then they might tell you, especially depending on the city that you’re in, you know, or the community that you’re working in. One client will talk to another client. Oh, yeah, I went to by and saw her on Saturday. Well, then you get somebody comes back and says well, how come you won’t see me on Saturday at all? Yeah, you know, and it’s I had a worms that you just don’t even want to. So yeah, you have to really be clear about what your scheduled hours are and make people respect them.
Barbara: Yeah. And sometimes you try to be nice and polite. And sometimes people don’t pick up on those cues.
Kerri: No.
Barbara: I’m sure they don’t mean to be, you know, offhanded or disrespectful. But some people they just they just don’t get it. They have to be told point blank. Look. I’m here from this time to this time. Don’t interrupt me in between.
Kerri: Yep. And don’t ask me what it is. Yes, exactly. And and if we can keep in mind, I think because for me anyway, if when I have I’ve had people who who do not recognize social cues like that. And they don’t do subtle, and I understand not doing subtle because I didn’t I didn’t understand subtle when I was younger, and I partied I was said to somebody at a house party. Tell me when to go home because I’m having so much fun I’m not going to see you looking at your watch. Right. But you have to remember I had to well, I had to remember for me anyway, that when somebody is missing out on the social cues, I don’t think it’s intentional. I don’t think I choose to believe that generally speaking people are good. And if they’re not catching on catching the you know the the messages you’re trying to send subtly. Just come right out and say listen, it’s like a party. I gotta go to bed. You gotta go home. I love you go away. Yeah, right. I got I have work to do. I you know, it’s nice that you stopped by cuz some people will stop by. That’s the other thing too. They’ll stop by for a visit, because they know that you’re home working, especially now that everybody’s more people are working at home. Yeah, right. Somebody will pop by and think that they can chew your ear off for half an hour. And it’s like, I have to go. Yeah, I don’t know. I have to go. And sometimes you have to physically shut the door on. Yeah. And it’s hard to not be frustrated and angry with them. Yeah, right. Like, I find that it’s really hard to not be rude. I want to be rude. It’s like, Why are you being so desperate? They’re not being disrespectful. They’re just not thinking because that’s not where they’re headed. So you just got it? They don’t remind them.
Barbara: They don’t see your context.
Kerri: No. Exactly.
Barbara: They don’t understand. Yeah. That’s right.
Kerri: And that I find that the most challenging is is being kind, when they’re not getting the common sense aspect that I’m portraying. It’s like, Can you not just, they can’t, and you just got to be kind and help them and again, but it comes down to what’s going to be good for us. Right? We make sure we understand that they’re going to be better for us.
Barbara: Yeah, that’s right. Speaking of being good to ourselves, don’t kill yourself with overtime either. Right? This brings me back to corporate. I was tough slogging 12 hours a day lunch at my desk didn’t break. And I was extremely ill, totally stressed out, fried really. And no one, no one noticed. First of all, nobody gave me any kudos for all my hard work or, you know, working so late and getting things done. And I learned quite abruptly after I got laid off from that company, that the works going to be there tomorrow. Llike I shouldn’t have been killing myself with trying to get all these things done impressing people that didn’t even notice. You know, so the thing is there to give yourself permission to take some time off. Yeah, and your brain needs to rest your body needs to rest. And you know, absorb all that information and all that energy that you’ve expended, to have to rest and take it easy. I read a book a while ago called the title of the book is called Rest by Alex Soojung-Kim Pang, and the subtitle of the book is why you get more done when you work less.
Kerri: Oh, wow.
Barbara: It’s an interesting concept it’s sort of counterintuitive, but it’s absolutely totally true. That the human body first of all, can only do one thing at a time with 100%. focus. But also when you change your focus, or when you rest your brain, it gives your body a chance and your brain a chance to step back and think things through, therefore making yourself more productive.
Kerri: Oh, no question.
Barbara: Yeah. Some famous people in history, there’s a quote here in the flyleaf, Winston Churchill, used to take daily naps during World War II.
Kerri: Wow.
Barbara: Can you imagine, that’s pretty extreme.
Kerri: Yeah.
Barbara: Charles Darwin would go for hours long strolls, just to clear his mind and think things through, Bill Gates spends a week alone in a cabin, all by himself, just thinking about stuff.
Kerri: Yeah, I can totally relate
Barbara: And these are to them, they’re the true fulfillment of success. Giving yourself permission to do it, first of all.
Kerri: Yeah, exactly
Barbara: And then actually doing it as well. Would you agree Kerri?
Kerri: Oh most definitely. I work, I used to work in a collaborative workspace where self employed people would all come together like an office team. But we all worked on our own stuff. And I was doing exactly what you described working through lunches, working through breaks. And not that anybody ever scheduled me a lunch or a break. But I didn’t get up from my desk, because I was so excited about what I was working on. And I just wanted to get more done so I can do, because it was all for me. And that was the difference between doing it for somebody else. You know, I had I’ve done it, I’ve done it. We’re working in the government, when I’ve had jobs there that I do the whole thing, I get that I get trouble for that from the people who are there that tell me that I’ll make them look bad, because I just like to keep busy, because my time goes by faster. You know, but in this case, I my mentor, was in the same in the same office space with me. And he invited me for lunch one day, and we will let you in. He fought me to go for lunch. And it’s like, No, no, I went, he’s like, you haven’t taken a break, just let’s go for lunch. And we stayed for three hours. And I felt like I was drinking wine. But I was not. Like I drank water the whole time. But it felt like the whole whole chat. And the whole atmosphere around our lunch that lasted three hours, was so relaxed and relaxed and social. And his whole point was, and we talked about all kinds of stuff. And it wasn’t until closer to the end of the three hours. And I didn’t know it was gonna be a three hour lunch. At the end of it, he was explaining to me how important it is to just back off. And that, you know, you have to get up and you have to take breaks. And I. And he was right, of course, because I got back and found out that, you know, all of a sudden, I have more energy to do what I was doing and a different perspective and way more enthusiasm because I’m not dragging my butt. You know, and I remembered at that same place, I worked with a guy who used to do 20 minutes, he had a timer come on his computer every 20 minutes. And it would come on and he would stop working. And he would go for a walk around the office or he’d make a coffee or he just do something completely different. And then he would do that for 20 minutes. And then he would come back and do two more 20 minutes. And he was so damn productive. It made me sick. And I only because I couldn’t it didn’t work for me. I tried it and it didn’t work for me. So I know that there’s different ways you know whether it’s a longer lunch every once in a while or setting a timer, whatever. There’s lots of different ways that you can work as long as you include that time to step away, because then all of a sudden you come back with a new vision.
Barbara: That’s right. Did you know that of the Pomodoro Technique?
Kerri: Yes, I’ve heard of it.
Barbara: The Pomodoro Technique and pomodoro in case you didn’t know is Italian for tomato.
Kerri: Oh, I did not know that.
Barbara: Yes. And tomato pomodoro is the person who invented it in the 1980s Francesco Cirillo actually use a tomato shaped kitchen timer, to test his theory and start this working 25 minutes on, and then five minutes off. 25 minutes on five minutes off, And it the whole thing stuck in is called actually called the Pomodoro Technique. And named after the kitchen timer. It’s really cool.
Kerri: Not named after the guy that created it, just the timer.
Barbara: Just the timer! It’s shaped like a tomato. Yeah.
Kerri: Wow.
Barbara: So it’s it there. Again, it’s the same thing where you take a some amount of time working at your task, right and then taking a break and then alternating back and forth. Personally for me, I like 45 and 15. Because 45 minutes gives me you know enough time to get into what I’m doing.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: I don’t think 20 minutes on 20 minutes off would work for me because it’s not enough time to get into it.
Kerri: That’s how I felt. Yeah cuz I want to delve deep enough that I’m at least immersed in it so that when I do step away, I’m not feeling like I have to start all over again.
Barbara: Exactly. Yeah, exactly. But for your colleague, of course, if it works stick to it now.
Kerri: Yeah, he was super productive Made me sick.
Barbara: It’s, the secret is finding what works for you. Me, I set the timer on my phone, I don’t have a tomato shaped kitchen timer. I set the timer on my phone. 45 minutes on 15 minutes off. And I keep doing that. And I get a lot of stuff done. And I’m very focused in those 45 minutes because I know I have a timer on.
Kerri: Yep, that makes sense.
Barbara: So it kind of shifts your thinking a little bit.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: So and yeah, and then you’re rewarded with a 15 minute break, go get a cup of tea, go for a walk, whatever it is.
Kerri: Yeah, that sounds like a really good idea. I like that. Actually. I’m gonna try that one because that sounds like it would work for me.
Barbara: Yeah. And of course the other strategy I use is taking a day off regularly. As a business owner, I can do that. I can take time off whenever I want.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: May not be as easy for employees, but the point is, you just take a day off, don’t do any work, don’t check your email, don’t do calendars, don’t do your diary, don’t do anything, just go and do something for a day. Take a complete brain break and you’ll come back the next day relaxed and refreshed, new perspective got fresh air in those gray cells. And it really helps cope with the day to day, don’t you agree?
Kerri: I do agree. I do. I’m like you said though, with companies, they give you time off, they give you scheduled holidays. Well, usually. And but for me, what I found was a struggle, as a self, as somebody who is self employed, yes, I have that control. But then there’s all this little things that need to get done that I have learned to call administrivia. And as little tiny, you know, regular day to day, tasks that have to be done. And I found that I was using my days that were going to be productive, doing all kinds of that crap instead. So what I have learned is that those little tasks that can be done by anybody, they’re not specifically geared that they have to be done by me, delegate them. And then when you do have a good one that’s taken care of, you do have time to take a day or an afternoon off. And you’re not thinking about all the little things that are piling up. And you get to have that that break. Because until you’re I mean, like for you, you’ve worked really hard to get where you are, with 16 years in this in this role that you’ve had after your corporate life, so that you found your rhythm. And but I know for a lot of people who are, you know, not as self employed for as not as long as you it’s hard to take that time away when you’re, you know, because everything’s just it’s your baby, it’s your business, you’ve got to do stuff.
Barbara: I know, right.
Kerri: But like I say, it’s wonderful that you’ve got that I’m just I’m still learning. But that was one of the things that I learned was to just take the little tiny little things off your plate that just there a time suck, and an energy suck. And it doesn’t you don’t feel better when they’re done, because it seems like they never stop.
Barbara: That’s right.
Kerri: Right. So being able to just hand them off to somebody and I’m going for I’m leaving, I’m going for a walk, I’m taking the day, whatever. And you don’t even have to tell anybody when you’re self employed except.
Barbara: No I know. It’s great.
Kerri: So yeah, that makes a huge difference. Again, all of every one of these things so far, all of them come out to personal boundaries, regardless of business.
Barbara: Yep.
Kerri: Right.
Barbara: And also, and the other side of that, too, I think Kerri, is giving yourself permission to do those things to take the day off to take time, your work sessions, you know, it, you have to allow yourself that time you have to tell yourself, it’s okay to take a day off. It’s gonna be there tomorrow.
Kerri: Well, and if we don’t tell ourselves, sometimes it doesn’t get said.
Barbara: That’s right. It’s true.
Kerri: And then we’re then we’re constantly beating, beating ourselves up for not getting things done. And yet, if we take the time away, that’s the other thing too, I found when you take a break, and you’re able to step back, as I remember, somebody said, don’t ever judge what you’ve done by what you see as on as what isn’t done. Look, you know, sometimes people are too far looking too far forward, that they get to see how much they’ve already accomplished by looking.
Barbara: That’s right.
Kerri: And if you take that take a step away. And you come back, I have found that I have more of a an appreciation for what I’ve done, to get me to where I’m at, as opposed to that run in the rat race and, and having everything pile up and spinning and not having a break. And just like it’s never going to stop when am I going to get to stop? Right. So, uh, yeah, I think and again, all of it’s just coming down to making sure that we take care of us in ourselves. In every aspect.
Barbara: It’s very, very important to take care of us. Yes. And I can even be brief by saying women especially.
Kerri: Yes, very much.
Barbara: We’re bad at taking care of ourselves, because we take care of everybody else first.
Kerri: Yeah. Because that’s what we’ve done. That’s Yeah. And that’s society has done that. And, and it’s not a bad thing, because it started when it started when it we needed it.
Barbara: Yeah yeah yeah, but still.
Kerri: It was our role. But there’s so much more now. No question. There’s so much more that if we don’t and, and the other part of the other side of that, too, is sometimes we have to remind people, as women that we have just as much right. As somebody else. It’s like, oh, I’m going golfing on Wednesday.
Barbara: Well, yeah, you do that all the time.
Kerri: Yeah. Well, that’s great. But what if you don’t golf? Right, then it’s like, well, yeah, why would you take well, why wouldn’t I take golfing and so on. So it’s good. You know what I mean? So, again, that’s the to me, I find that that’s another thing with the women aspect. It’s like sometimes we just have to remind people, then yeah, I need that break. Just like you need that break. Okay.
Barbara: Yeah, that’s right. Yeah. Yeah, we do have to put ourselves first so we can be on top form for everybody else.
Kerri: Yeah, exactly.
Barbara: No. Yeah
Kerri: I agree.
Barbara: Yeah. So thanks, Kerri, for joining me again for this wonderful podcast. Fantastic conversation as always.
Kerri: Oh you’re welcome. Thank you for having me.
Barbara: Interesting perspectives, and I look forward to our next podcast.
Kerri: Me too! Thank you.
Barbara: Okay. Take care.
Kerri: Okay. Bye, bye.
Barbara: In closing, I’d like to thank you so much for listening today. I hope this information was helpful, and I look forward to providing more. I’m Barbara Best CEO of Virtual Works, Inc.
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©Copyright 2022 Virtual Works Inc.
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DISCLAIMER
This material is provided for educational and informational purposes only.
No responsibility can be taken for any results or outcomes resulting from the use of this material.
The author does not assume any responsibility for the accuracy or use/misuse of this information.
by virtualworks | Aug 15, 2022 | Transcript
Learning Styles – Podcast Transcript
Barbara: Hi, I’m Barbara Best, and this is humans working remotely. A podcast where I’ll show you how to meet the expanding needs of your organization by utilizing alternative solutions for operational staffing, through expert insight and meaningful conversations with business professionals will talk about common challenges and proven strategies that will provide you with more time to focus on your organization’s mission, relationship building and other high value growth activities.
Did you know that there are three basic types of learning styles, the three most common are visual, auditory, and kinesthetic. To learn, we depend on our senses to process the information around us. Keep these ideas in mind when you’re presenting to your next potential client, to let them know how great you are, are when you’re doing your presentation. With me today is my colleague, Kerri, and we’re going to discuss and explore these areas of learning and provide more insights. So Kerri, what do you think? What do you think about these three areas? Or do you find one more popular than the other or so everybody different?
Kerri: I think everybody’s different. And the challenge is creating presentation, because you can’t go to everybody and say, so what kind of learner are you?
Barbara: Yeah, exactly.
Kerri: A lot of a lot of people know. And then there’s another chunk of a lot of people that have no clue. They just, they learn. And then and they couldn’t tell you what it is about learning that works. And if they have had a bad experience, they don’t necessarily blame it on the way it’s taught, but the teacher, and a lot of times, that’s not the case. But that’s so that’s the challenge. It’s I think it’s a it’s a mixed bag, it’s just a matter of finding ways to create a presentation that will help everybody from each area.
Barbara: Yeah, and I think everyone has maybe different amounts of each type of learning style in them. There’s a combination of all three and it depends on the delivery mode, I’m sure, learning via zoom, which we all do today, is much different than learning in an auditorium for example.
Kerri: Yes. Or or at a big boardroom table. Yeah, again, yeah, so totally different. But what we have that’s the key, right, we have to find a way to make sure we can reach everybody on some level, and then hope that they can grasp and move forward from there with what they need to know.
Barbara: Yeah, yeah, for sure. I’m a visual learner first, when I need to learn something, I read books, I collect books, but I also read a lot of books, I do a lot of reading. That’s how I learned. And as I’m reading, I also take numerous detailed notes. I’ve got stacks of tape flags that are right next to me. And I especially remember when that book came out The Da Vinci Code, when it was first published, it was this fantastically huge, it looked almost like an encyclopedia glossy pages, and there was pictures in it and as well as the the text or narrative of the book. And I just happened to open it, it was my husband was reading it at the time. And I happened to open it one day and I I literally got sucked right into those pages. Because it’s it there was color pictures, there was this wonderful context and text in this lovely writing and everything. And I could not put that thing down. And so that’s when I learned hey I must be a you know, I’m a visual learner, because I just, it just draws me right in. And I’ve never forgotten the book, which is one of my favorites, not because it’s controversial, but when it was in first print, it was in this lovely, almost encyclopedia bound issue with, you know, lots of color, and you know, it was just a wonderful experience that I still remember to this day.
Kerri: I don’t have a specific book like that. But I do have, when I I have reactions to books that I can feel the paper difference. And where I can so, because I know I’m a kinesthetic learner. I mean, for me, it’s when all else fails, read the directions. I unless I’m studying for school, I used to write notes constantly, because that’s how I studied. But when it comes to learning, I would rather sit there and watch it and then have somebody let me do it so they can watch what I’m doing and learn. But with a book, I get sucked into books. I love to read anyway. But if I had a book that has the gold leaf that you can feel, or the really old, like not even old, sometimes old, sometimes new, but the way that they’re bound, and the materials they’re bound in, that feeling to me will just make me that much more engaged in the idea of the book, regardless of what the books about. Yeah, feels nice. So yeah, I’m all about that experience. That personal experience.
Barbara: Yeah, I agree completely. And I, I’m a paper book person, I’m I do have an E book reader, I’m not so keen on the e-books. For that reason. I love the smell of the ink and the paper. And the smell when you open an old book, or you take off the flyleaf, or, you know, it just it’s just a totally different experience. And that’s where visual learning comes into play I think.
Kerri: Even the turning for me I find it’s the turning of the pages.
Barbara: Yes, yes.
Kerri: It’s scrolling or pushing a button. I have an old COBOL so if you push a button, and it moves, because it’s old. I miss turning pages. I mean, I was never one to fold down pages. But I missed the sound of the pages turning?
Barbara: Yeah, I know.
Kerri: It’s just it’s, it’s bizarre. The other thing I wanted to stick in here about visual learners that I discovered when I started doing presentations, you can’t give somebody a presentation where you want them to listen to you, and you want them to read. Because it uses the same part of the brain, to read and to listen. So they can’t, they can’t do both. And if what so when I was doing it, I was always having I would have imagery on screens, and then I would talk to it or just like a total not words. Total, not words, that makes no sense. But anyway, imagery and and, you know, stuff that would make the point without it’s all you have to read this. Because a lot of times I’ve been in workshops or presentations, and basically they’re putting on the screen, the exact same words that they’re reading. And if they’re not exactly, they’re so close that you notice when there’s a mistake. Totally defeats the purpose as far as I’m concerned. Anyway, it was a really good it was good to, for me to learn that because I’m not a visual learner. So I wanted to, you know, when I found that out, I was really grateful, because I know it makes it easier for people who do learn that way to do it right for them.
Barbara: Yeah, that’s all. And that goes back to talking to a potential client. If at all possible, try and find out how they learn. So then when you’re speaking or giving your presentation, you have the most impact. And they’ll go away thinking, Oh, yeah, I’ve really got what they do. Now. I’ve got to remember that yes, you know, right.
Kerri: Yes. And it’s not about the challenge. It’s the challenge is not always easy to get the information from them. But if you’re talking about doing a presentation for them, say they asked you to do one for your team. Find out which one of the presentations they’ve had, were most successful with the team. That would be a good way. Because it’s not like, again, can’t really say well, how do you look to learn? But if you can find out how you know how the team has responded to different types of presentations, then you’ve got an end like you say, and you come up, you know, shiny as a gold diamond or gold bell, because you’ve come through and you’ve given this great thing, meanwhile, you’re just using the information they gave you that said,
Barbara: That’s a great idea.
Kerri: Yeah. Because then you find out
Barbara: Great idea. Yeah. So then how does that impact auditory learners? Kerri, what do you think there?
Kerri: The, for me, the most important thing that I have heard for with auditory learners is they, you need to have an environment that lets them convey back to you what they’ve heard. And that’s the way that I have been taught to teach is, you say something, and then you clarify that they heard you properly. When you have an auditory learner, I think it’s very important to always have an opportunity for questions. It cannot not questions to go into detail that might be answered later in the presentation. But a clarification question, because sometimes when something is explained, and you use, you might use phrases that are not familiar, but if you can reframe it, for that auditory listener, you’re giving them the opportunity to get it because maybe again, like you said earlier, somebody may be an auditory, but then they may have another aspect that’s important to them. So, some, somebody might hear something auditory, but they’ve got it, they can visualize an experience in their head when they’re having it. And if they don’t get the right words to mesh, then they’re not able to get that clarity. So I, I find, it’s always good to say, is there any questions? Or does this make sense or something along those lines, just to give people chance for feedback, so that they and they have, and it’s really important to give it so that it’s not, doesn’t seem like you’re impatient. And I know that nobody would set out, I want to believe nobody would set up just to be impatient. I just want to get through this presentation. But sometimes that’s how it comes across. So I think it’s really important that we, you know, take our time and take a deep breath, and imagine we’re talking to a little tiny person, and, and being kind. And it’s like, Do you understand what I’m saying? And this is, but you’re not you’re not being condescending at all, but you’re giving them that that safety of, you know, the opportunity to have the form to challenge what you’re saying, say, I’m not really sure what you mean, or do you mean like this or this? Right, because that can make a huge difference in how people walk out of a meeting.
Barbara: Yeah, for sure. And it is always the good technique to ask people to confirm back. And that invites dialogue and open conversation. So it’s, you know, a combination of all those things that really goes a long way to engagement, especially on the auditory side of things as well.
Kerri: And that’s where you were mentioning to about the difference between being on zoom. And that’s again, that’s even that can that’s that that applies to visual as well as auditory, and kinesthetic. Kinesthetic, all the next one we’re going to talk about is the case. Yeah, all three of them. Auditorium versus a boardroom versus zoom.
Barbara: Yep.
Kerri: And all three different learning styles can be there. So that’s that. And that’s a key. Oh, one more thing about auditory listeners, people who are people a lot, some people who are auditory listeners are called Why Listeners. They’re very impatient. People listen for different reasons. If you are talking to somebody who is a why listener, they want to know why they should give you their attention right away. And if you miss the boat, and you don’t give them that what’s in it for me answer, you’re going to lose them. So that’s another thing to keep in mind when you’re talking and you’re presenting or developing a presentation. You want to make sure that you’re able to identify the very beginning, why they should give you their attention in the first place. And then, I mean, besides the fact that that’s what business is like, please, give your attention. I’m asking for it. Let me tell you why. Right away.
Barbara: Yeah, that’s right. Yeah, yeah.
Kerri: When you have a why listener that’s a key, because if they don’t get it right away, you won’t get them back.
Barbara: They’re gonna walk away. So you know, that you have, what’s that phrase? You have?
Kerri: Oh, with the 30 seconds?
Barbara: 30 seconds to make a good impression or something?
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: Yeah. Well, there it is. Right there. If you can answer their why question, especially a prospective client, you’re gonna lose them.
Kerri: Sure enough.
Barbara: Right.
Kerri: Most definitely. Yep. And that’s and then you can’t usually get them back because of the patient thing that usually turns to anger. It’s all gone. It’s a waste of my time.
Barbara: Mm hmm. That’s right. Yeah, it is. Yeah. You know? Yeah. And then what about kinesthetic learners? I, I remember as when I was going through college, I just, you know, I realized that, that I learned better or learn, maybe it depends on the context too of what you’re learning, that I do enjoy learning by doing as well as by reading. So I, what are your thoughts on that?
Kerri: Well, I, as I said earlier, I’m, I am primarily a kinesthetic learner, I would much rather get my hands in and get them dirty. I do like to read direction. Like you said, there’s a little bit of both in everybody. The biggest thing that I learned about kinesthetic learners, I didn’t know, when I was a kid, I never knew what it was, they didn’t take pay attention to stuff like that when I was young. And I’m in my 50s, so that’s dating myself, but that’s okay. But we didn’t know. And yet my daughter when she was in school, she was identified in grade three as a kinesthetic learner. And so they knew that she needed to be up and moving so she was the one that would hand out the pencils, or she was the one that would take attendance down to the office, right. And by the time she got into grade five, they had a corner of the classroom that was all carpeted off, so she could lie on her stomach and swing your legs. So I discovered with her the different things that people need to do like the movement, and I mean, you know, just being able to, like when I was saying about the the differences with the three different forums that you mentioned earlier with the auditorium, and some places you can sit and swing your leg, some places you can’t. If you’re a kinesthetic learner, and you can’t swing your leg while you’re listening, you know, when you can’t move, or you can’t stand up and stretch when you need to, you’re going to lose that person. So you want to again, those are the things that you want to keep in mind when you’re creating the environment that you’re going to be presenting into. Have a chance every 20 minutes to stand up and do a stretch. I say, focus for more than 20 minutes at a time without changing direction, have everybody get up and move a little bit, do a little dance and be goofy. And then you’re going to be able to keep everybody’s attention.
Barbara: Yeah. So and you also need to actually if, like, if you’re in a board meeting or something, you do need to invite engagement. And let people relate to them their experience that we can contribute to the meeting or to the group.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And that too is involved in there as well in kinesthetic learning, to engage and I don’t know if give permission is the right phrase, but allow other people to relate their experiences to the context that you’re talking about.
Kerri: Yes. And I think that I think that’s that’s an excellent point Barb, because what I have found is that until one person speaks up, nobody will.
Barbara: Exactly.
Kerri: And if you can get if you can get one person engaged with the feedback and come across that you’re in a safe environment, you can ask questions, share your experiences, that’s going to benefit everybody, no matter how they learn, everybody’s going to benefit. But it always, I find, it always takes a little nudging to get somebody to come right up, and when I’m in a group, I’m always the first one to volunteer, because I want my answer.
Barbara: Doesn’t surprise me.
Kerri: But what I find, though, is I’m the first one, and I always wait, I don’t just put my hand up first, like, you know, the kid we hated in high school. And then I don’t I never do that. I always wait. Because I know that I have no qualms with asking questions. But when nobody else asks, then I do and then people will start to ask if other people do, I hang back. And I wait. And then you know, as as the questions kind of peter off, then I’ll ask, but if nobody’s asking, I jumped up, and I’ll jump right in and I’ll say, I don’t understand or, and I, and I’m being honest about what I need for more information. But I also feel like I’m setting the stage to say, I’m here, and I’m ignorant. And I need to ask the question, so feel free to ask one with me and we’ll be learning together. Right? Because a lot of people are really nervous about asking questions, right? They walk away from the meeting. It’s like, I don’t know what the hell that was about.
Barbara: Yeah. And I do that too sometimes in a meeting, I will quite often ask a question, just for the benefit of those in the room.
Kerri: Yes, I’ve done that too.
Barbara: Whether I know the answer, or I don’t, I’ll still ask a question. Just to you know, like you just said, Kerri, get the ball rolling and get people, you know, start to thinking about, you know, maybe speaking up a little bit. And I’ve also noticed, too, the context of a meeting is much different too if you’re in a smaller group, right, say a room of I don’t know, five people, it’s a much different dynamic than if you’re in a room of 50 people.
Kerri: Oh, and even 10. 10 or 15, from 5.
Barbara: Much different energy there. So I think people are more much more comfortable in small groups. Anyway.
Kerri: I agree. Further to what you said about asking the question, even if you know the answer for the sake of the room, I think it’s also a good, that’s a good practice for the presenters to hear, because it’s letting presenters know that maybe they could be a little more detailed in their explanations, so that they’re not ending up having to have somebody say, well, can you clarify, because that’s kind of vague.
Barbara: Yeah. Right.
Kerri: If somebody did that to me, and I was presenting, I’d be making a note of that going, oh, I need to tweak how I say this because clearly my message is not coming through without clarification.
Barbara: Yeah. Right.
Kerri: So you’re actually helping the presenters when you’re making those asking those questions. But more so you’re helping the people in the group. Because then they’re oh, yeah, she’s asking I can ask now.
Barbara: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. We’re so human eh? We’re just so human. Do you have any other perspective, Kerri, on any of those three areas of learning?
Kerri: Oh, my, the one thing that I can say is when you know how somebody learns, keep it in mind always because, and again, this goes back to my daughter, and she was young. But it made such a difference for her knowing that she learned in a different way. And she advocated for herself. So it’s and it’s it’s similar to what I was saying about making giving the opportunity for people to feel safe asking questions, right. When my daughter was growing up, by the time she got to high school, she had advocated for herself. And it’s like, well, you need this. Well, you need to ask for this. Well, I don’t want to ask, do you want me to come to school? No! God forbid, mom comes to high school, right? And instantly, she started advocating, but it’s that same kind of thing for adults who aren’t accustomed to saying number one accustomed to admitting something they might see as a weakness where it is not a weakness. And they’re so they’re not accustomed to admitting it, and they’re not accustomed to seeking extra information to make it more palatable for them. Right. So I think it’s really important that yeah, that you, as long as you create a an environment that feels safe for your listeners, to have the freedom to ask questions asked by locations, given experience of their own, you know, then you’re going to want you’re going to have people walking, but I’ve really enjoyed that presentation. Because more often than not, meetings are boring. And if you host meetings with, yeah, with the engagement, all of a sudden, it’s better. So yeah, what about you? Have you had like, any, any awfulness that you had to deal with where people were not as receptive or if you were in it, and you didn’t have the you were given the opportunities to do the learning styles, and you were finding and noticing a difference in your class? Have you had any opportunities to to talk about that?
Barbara: Yeah, I’m still trying to figure out what you were trying to say. Because, you know, not an auditory learner.
Kerri: No no if your experience of yours. Have you found that when you were able to engage the learning styles as you learn them from your group, did you have Have a better experience?
Barbara: Yes, of course. And it’s, it’s quite often, in my experience anyway, kind of a tough thing to nail down. You know, you’re delivering your content, I prefer small rooms, small meetings, as you’re delivering your content you, in my experience anyway, I didn’t know learning styles of the people I was working with. Right, right, you know, beforehand. And then as I started presenting material, I kind of got a sense you kind of, I guess, the way people act or what they say or they don’t say, or if they’re not engaged, they’re not even looking at you. You can kind of figure out what kind of learning style they have.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And then I learned how to adapt very quickly. And then I just customize my presentation to the people in the room. And before I know it, the energy is lifted. It’s much more engagement because I’m paying attention to each person’s needs. I know the person. Yeah, the person at the back of the room who’s not looking at me, but I know they’re listening. Yes, I know. They’re an auditory learner. Yep. And then the person who is looking impatient or pissed off or whatever, they are an auditory learner.
Kerri: Yes.
Barbara: And then you’ve got the person who’s, you know, kind of looking anxious like, when are we going to actually learn this stuff? Like, what? I gotta do something. Of course they’re kinesthetic learner.
Kerri: Yeah. Yeah.
Barbara: And then you’ve got the people who are, you know, you say something or you present a concept, oh, where do I find that? Where can I read? They’re a visual learner.
Kerri: Yes. Or they’re always in the front yes. You know, though, it’s so good that you are aware of those things because someone less experienced than you might be offended if somebody was in the back listening and not not not they might not know that they’re listening, all they see is they’re not looking. And that could make somebody feel really…
Barbara: Offended.
Kerri: Yes. Offended or or crestfallen if they work really hard on their presentation so that’s, that’s a really good piece to mention, I think because people will, people will realize can realize that, just because you’re not seeing the engagement doesn’t mean it’s not there.
Barbara: Exactly. Right. Exactly. I found that with I was giving a lecture at Ottawa U, Telfer University, about oh, five or six years ago, and it was in one of those lecture halls where the seats rise, they go to the back of the room. And the professor said, See those guys at the back of the room there, they’re staring at their laptops, they’re actually listening to you. They just don’t look like they are. So just do your thing. And I thought, oh, okay, cool. I’ll do that. Yeah, yeah.
Barbara: And the other thing I’ve learned too, and I’ll leave you with this thought, I read in a book called, The Way We’re Working isn’t Working by Tony Schwartz. I learned in there and it still sticks in my mind that the brain cannot do two things at the same time with 100% attention. It’s not possible. The brain is not programmed that way. So this concept we have, especially in this day and age where everything’s fast track and got to do it. This concept of multitasking, quote, unquote, is a total myth. Yeah, just we may think we’re multitasking, we’ve got all these things on the go. But the brain is not giving 100% attention to any one of them.
Kerri: No, we’re just stretching our stress, stretching ourselves and stressing ourselves at the same time for no reason.
Barbara: That’s right. Yeah. So we made our mistakes, or we missed something or miss a deadline or a meeting or whatever. That’s could be the reason why. So very interesting. Our brain is so intelligent, it just, it’s mind boggling, no pun intended, that we’re programmed the way we are. it’s just so fascinating.
Kerri: I agree.
Barbara: So thanks very much, Kerry, for joining me today on this fantastic conversation again.
Kerri: Thank you for having me, it was fun.
Barbara: Yeah, yeah, it was thanks. Take care.
Kerri: Okay, take care. Bye bye.
Barbara: In closing, I’d like to thank you so much for listening today. I hope this information was helpful, and I look forward to providing more. I’m Barbara Best CEO of Virtual Works, Inc.
There’s a couple of action steps you can do:
©Copyright 2022 Virtual Works Inc.
All rights reserved
DISCLAIMER
This material is provided for educational and informational purposes only.
No responsibility can be taken for any results or outcomes resulting from the use of this material.
The author does not assume any responsibility for the accuracy or use/misuse of this information.
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